Looking at the time trial BRI

[Otto]

Dan:

Your concern about the different performance of a car with, say 10 points in a P class vs the 20-points max will always be there given our class/point system. The BRI measure will have to follow those class breaks as we cannot be making minute adjustments for every 2 points within a class. The system would be impossible to police and would get out of hand. For this reason, it behooves competitors to think twice if and how they want to modify their car because their decision might place them at the low-end of a higher class and thus render them uncompetitive. Part of the fun and challenge of what we do is to try to set up our cars so that we can be competitive within the points and cost allowances that represent our constraints.

Anyway, more to the point are your comments that you also agree with Tom's expert remarks about the need to spread out the BRI factors between lower and higher car classes to take into account the higher speed potential of the higher classes in a TT setting vs an AX. Does anybody think otherwise and if so, why?

Interestingly, based on a new Rules proposal for 2006, Stock classes will likely be allowed 8 points of modifications, up from 6. Given that other classes remain the same, the BRI factor of Stock classes should also be adjusted upwards by the same proportion.

Any other comments?

[ttweed]

The car with a lower number of mod's/points will most likely not catch the car in the same class with maximum points, yet the BRI makes no adjusted equilization for these two cars. So, a car/driver that has minimum mod's will wind up much lower than a car with maximum mod's within the same BRI index.

Dan-
The same thing is true in all of the class competition, not just the BRI. If you begin to modify your car, great care should be taken in understanding the rule set under which you compete, and the relative value of modifications in lowering lap times, if you care at all about being competitive in your class. Once you step up from SS class, you must consider what it will take to optimize your car for the next higher class. If you are not prepared to maximize its speed potential with allowable modifications in order to compete with other cars in the class that have, you should not be concerned about being competitive within the class structure OR the BRI.

As Otto said, the basis for the index must assume a fully developed car under the allowable modifications for each level of preparation. It cannot be broken down any further, in the same way that we cannot have a separate class for each different model Porsche out there. We lump together different models with similar performance in the various letter classes for the same reasons of simplicity. Some models are "more ideal" than others within the same class. If you happen to drive one of the cars that is less competitive within the class structure, or you choose to do some modifications which bump you into a higher class but not go all the way to the maximum for the class, then you better be a very good driver if you still want to win, because somebody else certainly will take their car that far.

TT

[Dan Chambers]

Otto and Tom:

I agree with you, and I'm aware of the disparity of classes, car types, indexing the cars to classes from SS all the to AR - all that stuff. There is no way BRI and calssification systems can be tweeked to every 2 or 4-point gain in car improvements. The current classification system essentially encourages you to modify your car to the very top of the points scale to remain competitive in those classes. After years of driving competitively, it's all pretty clear to me how it works. It's just a shame that in some driving venues, the wallet will speak louder than the driving/skill level in order to remain competitve in P-and-above classes, IMHO.

My point was to identify the huge increase in gaps of points (and therefore expenditures) once a driver leaves the SS and S classes. The way I see it, the points spread in classes (and the BRI) is directely linked .... to a driver's budget. So, once a driver enters P class and above, its a little more about the improvements you start making to the car in order to be competitive, and a little less about skill level. (And, I understand that there are a couple of examples of drivers with limited equipment expenditures that really kick-bu++ at different events -Tim Comeau, Jad Duncan, Bill Ibbitson, Jackie Corwin, Mark Foley, Ralph Linares, Jerry Sturm. ) Then again, there's always the Spec class, and the 944 Challange that Tim occasionally runs....

Maybe that's why I like surfing so much. It doesn't matter how much you spend on equipment. If you can't surf .... you can't surf. And no amount of money will allow you to paddle out on a 10-foot day at Pipeline without killing yourself and endangering others.

So, just my 2-cents regarding the extreme points spreads in P, I and M classes, and it's effect on a driver's wallet, vs true driving skill as represented in the BRI.

See you next weekend.

[ttweed]

The current classification system essentially encourages you to modify your car to the very top of the points scale to remain competitive in those classes.

Yup. That's why there's Street Stock, along with all the changes to the rules over the last few year to prevent any modifications in that class, no?

It's just a shame that in some driving venues, the wallet will speak louder than the driving/skill level in order to remain competitve.

In some venues? They're all like that, from karts to F1. Even the "Spec" classes, which are designed to level the field and hold down costs have great disparity in equipment. Yes, there are guys out there driving $5,000 junkyard dogs and doing OK, but there is always someone with a fat wallet willing to "blueprint" their car to the edge of the rules, and if they also happen to be a competent driver, they end up on the sharp end of the grid. The fact is that motorsports is a hideously expensive endeavor, even on the amateur level. There are people who contend that a half a million dollars is not enough to prevail in a full season of Club racing in the top classes! The phrase "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!" comes to mind.

So, once a driver enters P class and above, its a little more about the improvements you start making to the car in order to be competitive, and a little less about skill level.

A little, for sure, but there are always going to be people driving fast cars slow and slow cars fast.

Maybe that's why I like surfing so much. It doesn't matter how much you spend on equipment. If you can't surf .... you can't surf.

I'm with you on that one! In 45 years of surfing I never spent as much money as I have on any one of my cars. That's why the recurring theme of the first article I ever wrote for our newsletter was "kaa-chiing!"

So, just my 2-cents regarding the extreme points spreads in P, I and M classes, and it's effect on a driver's wallet, vs true driving skill as represented in the BRI.

I'm still not following you on this one, as it seems to me the BRI is fashioned to give those who don't spend the big bucks to prepare their cars and just run in the lower SS and S classes with older cars a better shot at some glory.

See you next weekend.

I wish I could, but it appears I will be traveling up north for awhile and will miss the next event.

TT

[MikeD]

Maybe that's why I like surfing so much. It doesn't matter how much you spend on equipment. If you can't surf .... you can't surf.

I'm with you on that one! In 45 years of surfing I never spent as much money as I have on any one of my cars. That's why the recurring theme of the first article I ever wrote for our newsletter was "kaa-chiing!"

I'm not a surfer, but I can most certainly identify with this statement.

KAA-CHING! The cash register opened and my bank balance began its plunge into severe anorexia.

BTW, nice article Tom.

[Dan Chambers]

Quote:
"I'm still not following you on this one, as it seems to me the BRI is fashioned to give those who don't spend the big bucks to prepare their cars and just run in the lower SS and S classes with older cars a better shot at some glory."

Yes, Tom. I agree. Once past the S class the BRI is less significant, and the BRI does give the SS and S class drivers some dignity in the pits.

Sorry we'll miss you Saturday. All the best!

[street235]

Delayed again, why now? V