Streets of Willow - gonna start a new debate

[jack miller]

I see that our web guru listed SOW as clockwise without asking me. Here's why I want you to stay open-minded to running CCW.

1. the bowl entry is way more fun, challenging and a better cajone-test CCW.
2. the S-section after the bowl is way more fun, more drifting and more likely to spin.
3. you can get more tail action on the skid pad.
4. the front straight is faster.

I know it's bumpier up at the top of the hill, but it's not exactly smooth the other way either. The brake zone before the skid pad requires a lot more braking, but that's a good thing in terms of skill, if you're not worried about the money you're spending burning up your brakes; and, who got into this sport to save money? And, yes, you don't have turn 1 up the hill which is an ok turn, but it's not really that great, so that leaves me thinking the only thing CW has going for it is it's smoother and easier on brakes, and yeah, maybe the downhill into the kink...

Let the debate begin.

[Steve Grosekemper]

Jack,

Don't blame the Guru he is innocent, that was me and I actually put no thought in it as it was just pasted in from last years event.

I just made the correction and gave you some advertising, check it out if you like then click refresh...Hit the CW?

http://www.pcasdr.org/timetrial/index.html

But since you asked here is my 2 cents.

The bump at the top is like going over a curb in my car. It is very hard on the front suspension.

The skid pad is murder on tires and brakes in the CCW direction and I believe we have run the CW configuration more than CCW so we have more lap time data to judge our level of improvement.

And finally most of our tracks are CW and most cars are set up to go that direction. Changing direction means changing setup then changing it back for the next race.

My vote is for CW.

[Curt]

My vote is for CCW on Saturday and CW on Sunday with timed runs both days, or best practice lap time used for a double point, dual TT event.

Changing set-up for going CW or CCW? Man, I need to take this hobby way more seriously

[Gary Burch]

After running both directions, I like CCW. Like Jack says the course flows much better. It also takes out that blind chicane at the end of the straight after the bowl. Ask Dan Chambers about that. But, Curt's idea of doing both ways sounds fun.

[Dan Chambers]

After running both directions, I like CCW. Like Jack says the course flows much better. It also takes out that blind chicane at the end of the straight after the bowl. Ask Dan Chambers about that. But, Curt's idea of doing both ways sounds fun.

CCW is an unknown to me, but based on everyone's comments after CCW in 2004, I'm game to try it. Besides .... I spent my "wheel replacement" tokens at the 2005 event, and don't have any fresh wheels to bend .

On the other hand, a 3000 Lb. car eats brakes like candy at events that have a big braking zone after a down-hill straight. Tires ..... I'm not too worried with RA-!'s, but brake-pads are another story. I guess if I had to choose between fresh brakes, and fresh rims, I'd bargain for replacing the brake pads.

Either way, I know I'll have fun. It's always a hoot to drive the TT's. I'm definitely in for SOW .... a low-hp dream.

[Mike]

I dislike the blind chicane too.
Curt's idea is cool, each day change direction.
Except not excited about a couple of hours of timed runs Saturday afternoon instead of track time...
If both days the same my vote is CCW.
Option 3 just shift the event to Big Willow!

[martinreinhardt]

It would be nice to have offical times in both directions or even make 2 TT's events out of it. Saturday TT 1 Sunday TT 2.

Just an idea , don't shoot me for it

[MVZ944T]

I like either direction, but having had a fair amount of time running both with the PCA and POC, I think that CCW requires a bit more skill that CW. I also agree with Steve that CCW at the top of the hill is tough on suspension, no doubt about that. I am game for one way one day and one way the next. I like the faster downhill going into the skid pad. No worse on brakes than Star Mazda at BW.

[kary]

I have not run the CCW direction so cannot comment. I can comment on the CW direction. I find the front straight going up hill into a turn a good challenge and place that differentiates drivers. The rest of the mess prior to the back bowl is just a turny bumpy mess. Enough said about that. Going to the back bowl is challenging if you try and carry maximum speed. The penalty is severe if you miss off the back side. Plenty of pucker factor if you drive it hard. Going into the chicane following the straight after the bowl is very challenging as it is blind, bumpy. Another differentiator in my opinion. I take it in fourth gear over the bump, wait to land, brake and down shift to third still trying to stay on the track. Like all of that except for the bumpy landing which continues to be bumpy making it difficult to down shift. The rest of the turns to the skid pad require some ability to carry good speed from the chicane. The challenge here in my mind is to not over brake the blind chicane and to continue carrying speed around the 90 degree left turn prior to entering the right onto the skid pad. Now setting up for the front straight run is critical with that challenging uphill right turn ending that I mentioned before.

I like this configuration except for the severe bumps in the middle and on the landing of the chicane. I think this track has some differentiators that make it appealing. But if I had a choice I would not run at SOW in any direction.

my 5 cents.....

[Gary Burch]

Sorry Dan, I thought it was at the CCW SOW not the CW SOW. It was the chicane, right?

I love SOW, whatever the direction.

[gulf911]

My vote is for CCW on Saturday and CW on Sunday with timed runs both days, or best practice lap time used for a double point, dual TT event.

If you want to use practice for timed runs go join the POC for one of their events.

I have run both directions and I vote for CW. I think the track was designed CW and IMHO flows much better Than CCW. It seems from some descriptions some feel its 'safer' CCW. It is an excellent and fun track.

[Steve Grosekemper]

Running one day CCW and the other CW seem counter productive. If we run times Saturday we loose 2 sessions. If we don't we have 3 sessions to nail our best time.

I thought we did 2 days so we could really learn the track not just wear our cars out?

I am going to throw another wrench in this debate...

How about no timed runs at all? Use your best transponder time of the weekend and go home an hour earlier.

Just a thought...

[kary]

I am not sure why we want to change our format since it has been so successful in the past years. There does not seem to be any reason to run two different tracks over the same weekend that I can see. Traditionally Saturday is about re-learning and learning the track, setting up the car, getting our weekend warrior heads back in the race seat. Sunday is about final practice in the morning and lat minute changes to setup and driving sections in the track prior to timed runs in the afternoon. I think we should keep it that way.

If you want different directions, timed runs throughout the day then go to POC STS. They have reduced track time and it is much more crowded which is something I am not interested in either (that last statement include the POC TT series as well).

[Curt]

I'm fine with running it our normal way. No problem at all. I just suggested it to throw Steve off who sets up his car differently depending on which direction we are running the track.

POC STS sucks big time compared to our TT series, so no thanks.

[Steve Grosekemper]

I'm fine with running it our normal way. No problem at all. I just suggested it to throw Steve off who sets up his car differently depending on which direction we are running the track.

POC STS sucks big time compared to our TT series, so no thanks.

Curt,
It is not just me, that is for sure!
I am just lazy and don't want to work on my car at the track I want to drive it!
Have you taken a walk down the pits of one of out Time Trials?
All those adjustable camber plates aren't there just because they look cool!

If you had the mouse motor that I have you'd be making every adjustment you could as well, Mr 2.9-RSR.

You all should see the video I have of our 89-91 time trial series... It's histarical to see what the track adicts were running back then!
We have come a long way, that is for sure...

I have to agree with Kary, keep it the way it is.