Need help/advice purchasing classic porsche 67-69

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Need help/advice purchasing classic porsche 67-69

Postby djgonzo on Mon Aug 23, 2004 4:24 pm

I'm looking into purchasing a classic 911 between the years of 67-69. The two models I'm currently looking at are a restored 67 911S and a 69 911E sunroof. I'm looking for a reliable driver that's mostly restored.

Any suggestions, comments or advice on these models and buying classic porsches from restoration shops/dealers would be appreciated. Is there any reason that one model would be better than the other etc.?
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Postby ttweed on Mon Aug 23, 2004 4:45 pm

Yes, there are differences in the models for those years which can radically effect their value. "S" models are generally more desireable and valuable than "E" or "T" models, for one thing, but condition plays a huge part in the price of an early 911. The range for the 2 cars you mention could be anywhere from $6-7K for a beater to $45K for an immaculate, low miles, original example.

The most important thing that you can do is to have a thorough PPI (Pre-Purchase Inspection) done on any early 911 by someone who is very familiar with the early cars before you buy it. The 911 unibody was not fully galvanized inside and out until 1976-77, so rust can be a huge problem, depending on the car's history. The condition of the running gear (especially the engine and transaxle) are vital, as the cost of rebuilding these can exceed the purchase cost of the vehicle.

Myself, I am very partial to the '67 911S and would definitely choose it over a '69E, given equal condition. :D

TT
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Postby Pete Millikin on Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:11 pm

Hey Tom- I thought the conventional wisdom was the the longer wheelbase models from 69 on were more desirable due to better overall drivability, especially at speed, and parts compatability with the later models which translates into relatively cheap upgrades. You know this stuff much more than me, but I'd like to know your take.
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Postby djgonzo on Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:29 pm

(ttweed)

Thanks for the advice. The '69 911 E is being sold by a restorer/dealer in the Bay area. that has specialized in restoring porsches for 30+ years. He bought the car from the orig. owner here in CA. Engine and tranny are rebuilt w/ 0 miles. Recently repainted the orig. color and has the upgraded 911S suspension and brakes along with new seals throughout the car.

I know less about the '67 911S. It is being sold by another dealer/restoration shop in So Cal that seems to be pretty reputable in selling high end classic euro sports cars. I guess the car hasn't come in yet but they're going to get back to me with the details later this week.
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Postby ttweed on Tue Aug 24, 2004 9:12 am

Pete Millikin wrote:Hey Tom- I thought the conventional wisdom was the the longer wheelbase models from 69 on were more desirable.
Pete- you are entirely correct about this. The LWB models from '69-89 are almost totally interchangeable on parts and have many improved features, not the least of which is the 2" longer wheelbase. Some of the '65-68 parts are definitely NLA or very expensive.

If your intention is to buy a car and upgrade for the track, I would always recommend the '69-73 models (although '69 is kind of a bastard year for transplants- ask Arnie Classen, and the '72-73 cars are better if you are going to convert to coilover suspension.) However, a SWB car can also be converted to LWB and have entire SC/Carrera running gear and flares added if desired, it is just a little more expensive. I know of a '66 widebody conversion recently for sale here in SD for about $13K, and it is indistinguishable from a later model in most every way, with an '82SC engine, transaxle and running gear.

However, we were talking here about buying a restored or original car, and in that case, the 1967 911S, being the first of the "S" models produced by the factory, would have more "cachet" than a '69E, in my opinion, which would translate to greater desireability and value in the marketplace. The SWB cars can make an excellent autox weapon in stock form also, although the greater inherent oversteer can make them less attractive as a "big track" car. On the street, there is very little difference in handling or driveability, as long as you aren't pushing the limits of grip frequently.

In Bruce Anderson's last update on early 911 values, he placed the 1967 911S in excellent condition at $16,125. A corresponding condition '69E he estimated at $12,200. I think that reflects the relative value well, although it is considerably less than what a very well restored or original example of either would go for in the current market. BA calls such cars "beyond excellent", and doesn't really include them in his estimates. As I mentioned previously, such cars can fetch prices in excess of $40K.

TT
Last edited by ttweed on Tue Aug 24, 2004 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby ttweed on Tue Aug 24, 2004 9:32 am

djgonzo wrote: The '69 911 E is being sold by a restorer/dealer in the Bay area that has specialized in restoring porsches for 30+ years.
I hope to high heaven that you are not talking about Wayne Krieger's shop in the Bay area (formerly Born2BFast, AKA Sears Point Classics). There have been multiple complaints about him in both the 356 and early 911 community. Go to the Early 911S Registry forum at http://d240157.u39.zeonhost.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3924 and read about some people's experiences with him.

Each of the two cars you are considering would have to be judged on their individual condition and price. Having an informed outside assessment of each would be crucial, IMHO. The reputations of the shops involved must also be considered. There is plenty of information on the site above to get you thinking about the issues involved.

Good luck in your search,
TT
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Postby djgonzo on Tue Aug 24, 2004 9:46 am

wow :shock: Thanks for the warning! That is the exact guy and company I was looking into on the 69 911 E. He actually sent me a ton of pictures but after reading those posts and warnings I'm not taking any chances. That's why I always ck with guys like yourselves on these forums before I make purchases.

Does anyone know anything about a company in Costa Mesa, CA called European Collectibles?

Again as always, thanks for the input and advice!
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