Kary, how about a Car and Class index?

[bryanearll]

The BRI seems to do a pretty darn good job. The top drivers in the BRI seem to be the best drivers (slanted towards the best cars? or PERHAPS, the best drivers also drive the best cars?)

Speaking ONLY of NS/S and NS class and after looking over the Rennlist comments (993 vs 996 (our group classifies the 993 turbos with the 996)) Chuck Hassel finished at the top of NS, which would seem to counter any claim I might have on 993's being quicker on the AX course. (of COURSE it's the CAR>>>)

So back to 3 seconds faster. What is the 911 (whether 993 or 996 better at? How do the two compare to the Boxster S? What really separates the 996 vs the GT3? 80hp reallys make the difference out of the hole, but does it in an AX. If so, how do those 914's still keep hammering the competition (forgetting the 944 spec)

Driving the excellent (difficult) course Saturday I wondered; "if he AX chairman was designing a course for the 996 what would follow?"

Which led to:
If there was some agreement about what the classes were 'good at', wouldn't it be interesting to challenge the field by designing courses that favored a class?
Bryan

[bibbetson]

In all the years that I have been driving AX's (10ish now), I have never been able to walk a track and know that it would be good for my car (or me). All those years I have driven the same type of car (front engine 4 cyl rear drive balanced car) so you would think I would get used to a given track design. It is never that simple. There are so many variables that go into a given course that I think it's impossible to throw a track for a given car or driver. That is, beyond the very tight and very open extreams.

Although I have never driven a 993 or 996, I'm sure that there is nothing similar between a 964, 951, 968 and 928 (K class) on an AX course. Many other classes have very competative, dissimilar cars as well.

To go fast on these courses there is only one secret - maximize the use of the traction circle. If you tune yourself for it and then your car for it, you will go fast on most any course. Problem is that you can't forget about it, even for a split second, or you will have already lost tenths of a second on the course.

[kary]

Speaking ONLY of NS/S and NS class and after looking over the Rennlist comments (993 vs 996 (our group classifies the 993 turbos with the 996)) Chuck Hassel finished at the top of NS, which would seem to counter any claim I might have on 993's being quicker on the AX course. (of COURSE it's the CAR>>>)

I must have missed something but doesn't chuck drive a 996 not a 993? He beat the other 993's quite handily, though I do not know those drivers.

At any rate, what exactly are you asking/posting here?

[bryanearll]

I guess I rambled a bit...so I will ramble some more...

Chuck does drive a 996 with stickier tires and maybe some other minor tweaking. He drives well enough to instruct me and finish's well in the N class regardless of category.

Ed, at this AX and Jon at the January event both performed at a level that was close to the NS and NP category winners.

It seems to me in NSS that the 993 turbos seem to be very challenging to beat.

The Boxster's seem to clobber most of the stock field in the AX's.

Speaking with Steve Dente in January, he felt that I was leaving 4-5 seconds on the track. Looking at the results this time maybe I improved a second in that split.

My question is: If you were designing an AX course to favor the 993 or 996, what would it look like? And is the BRI for the NSS class or even the N class in general a tad high when squaring off against some of the other classes, like the Boxster class. I would point out only one finisher in the N class was in the top 20.
Bryan

[kary]

I guess I rambled a bit...so I will ramble some more...

Chuck does drive a 996 with stickier tires and maybe some other minor tweaking. He drives well enough to instruct me and finish's well in the N class regardless of category.

Ed, at this AX and Jon at the January event both performed at a level that was close to the NS and NP category winners.

It seems to me in NSS that the 993 turbos seem to be very challenging to beat.

The Boxster's seem to clobber most of the stock field in the AX's.

Speaking with Steve Dente in January, he felt that I was leaving 4-5 seconds on the track. Looking at the results this time maybe I improved a second in that split.

My question is: If you were designing an AX course to favor the 993 or 996, what would it look like? And is the BRI for the NSS class or even the N class in general a tad high when squaring off against some of the other classes, like the Boxster class. I would point out only one finisher in the N class was in the top 20.
Bryan

Now I understand your question, thank you for clarifying.

1. AX courses taht favor a 993 or 996 are courses where horsepower and braking are important. If the AX track limits low speed tight turns again the 993 and 996 has a great advantage. This is not to say that a car like a 944 turbo would not like a 993/996 track, it would very much. When I was auto-x chari for a few years I built some tracks that people felt favored horsepower cars, though it turned out that there were also some handling sections that also favored other cars, which in the end made it a wash.

2. BRI classifications, I believe are flawed particularly at auto-x's where folks are newbie's to really driving. One cannot compare drivers in various classes because the drivers are all at different levels. Trying to compare this within the BRI is flawed as are some of the car classifications. I would love to run a 993 TT against a 996 for example.

My recommendation, is ignore the BRI, and compete with some friends in your class and improve your driving, because if Chris Benbow were to show up in his Boxster S with Hoosier's on you would all be shocked His car and his driving are very very good and would simply destroy the times you say at the last auto-x (GT2 not withstanding).

[bryanearll]

Like I said, Steve Dente felt like the car could do better and that I wasn't yet driving at it's limits. Certainly Chuck Hasel found a few seconds for me by sitting in with me as instructor in the second practice section. I just 'didn't get' the course.

I am quite the newbie still, having just graduated from student to driver, so I look to the class results and the BRI to see if I'm improving.

Since my times were pretty much within a half a second of each other, finding 3 seconds sounds like a big deal; but its there, just have to find the right line.
b

[Kim Crosser]

Looking at the BRI - in the top 20, there are cars from 15 different classes (AM, AR, CS, GS, ISS, KI, KP, KS, LSS, MSS, MS, NSS, NS, PP, and PS). What that tells me is that the BRI allows the top drivers in each class to get into the top BRI places, which seems like the intent of the BRI. I.e., it favors the drivers who can get the most out of their cars within their respective classes.

Getting the most out of your car involves two things - prepping your car and then driving it.

I would wager that more than half the AX participants have never had their suspensions checked for optimum handling (camber, toe-in particularly) - let alone had them adjusted (zero points, by the way). If you are driving with a sub-optimal set-up, you are limiting how competitive you can be - you may be giving up a second or more that you will never get back, no matter how well you drive the car.

The driving part is heavily mental - prepping, thinking, analyzing, adjusting, etc. I suspect that the majority of the faster drivers drive on the street like they do on the track - mentally always looking for turn-in, apex, and track-out points - consciously or unconsciously.

With your car prepped, and you focused mentally, the rest is experience (seat time) and instruction - finding the limits of your car and getting comfortable driving at those limits. Get to those points and you should find yourself moving up in the BRI.

[jrgordonsenior]

Speaking ONLY of NS/S and NS class and after looking over the Rennlist comments (993 vs 996 (our group classifies the 993 turbos with the 996)) Bryan

As I interpet this year's new classifications, the 993 and 996 Twin Turbos are "P" cars along with GT2's & 3's. The NA 993 and the NA 996 through year 2001 are "N" cars. From 2002 the NA 996 is an "O" car.
If not, I ran in the wrong class at Fontana.....