Buttonwillow lap videos

[gulf911]

Ok Jad,
Perhaps you can give me a round about figure of what you have in your car to date? I'll bet its either more or at what I have. I also have over 20 points available for my car before the next class. oh, I'll have my arm out allright...to smack you upside the head as I pass...

[Tim Comeau]

Don't tell ME about it.........I come from 911's. Drove one for about 15 years.........but we still have to balance our cars at speed.

[jplavanjr]

Balance? Oh yeah... 50/50 vs. 40/60....plllleeeeeaaaaasssssseeee....

Mine's 34/66! on 225/50s and 15x7 wheels


And 175hp. That makes a HUGE difference. There's no accelerating out of turns and down the straights and chutes. It's all momentum and sometimes (most times) to get a good late apex you need to turn in a little harder and drift by the apex to be able to keep the momentum up at exit without slowing as much to get around a turn and not have the tail lights leading the way.

And more fun anyway. Who wants to drive holding everything still? Much more satisfying to go fast looking out the wind wing!

[gulf911]

Thanks JP, it was nice to hear and see how an early 911 is driven at speed. It seems the 944 concensus of some is, if you aren't holding the wheel steady you aren't smooth...In an early 911 that's not the case, at least from what I have seen and heard. I think Tim gets it however...

[ttweed]

It seems the 944 concensus of some is, if you aren't holding the wheel steady you aren't smooth...

I rode w/ Jackie (Ms. 944-Spec) Corwin at the last autox, and she rode in my 911, and after the first practice session, she asked me why I was moving the wheel so much and so fast.

I told her it's not the steering wheel inputs that have to be smooth, it's the car's movement that counts. As long as the vehicle is smoothly carving the desired arc at a good slip angle, and transitioning weight smoothly from side to side without upsetting the grip of the tires, it doesn't really matter what the driver is doing with the steering wheel to accomplish that. Sometimes it takes quick little corrections to be smooth, with both the throttle AND the steering wheel, especially in a 911. They aren't necessarily BIG movements, amplitude-wise, but they sometimes have to be FAST.

I think my explanation was a little foriegn to her, coming from the waterpumping, 50/50, front-engine, 944 world.

TT

[Jad]

Tom, your description may be accurate, but you are missing the point, if you say smoother is better and that sawing at the wheel is bad, it really ruffles Dan's feathers and causes me great pleasure which would certainly not be accomplished by letting him know the obvious, different cars require different styles and that he is a really good driver. The facts just are not always the best answer

[kary]

It seems the 944 concensus of some is, if you aren't holding the wheel steady you aren't smooth...

I rode w/ Jackie (Ms. 944-Spec) Corwin at the last autox, and she rode in my 911, and after the first practice session, she asked me why I was moving the wheel so much and so fast.

I told her it's not the steering wheel inputs that have to be smooth, it's the car's movement that counts. As long as the vehicle is smoothly carving the desired arc at a good slip angle, and transitioning weight smoothly from side to side without upsetting the grip of the tires, it doesn't really matter what the driver is doing with the steering wheel to accomplish that. Sometimes it takes quick little corrections to be smooth, with both the throttle AND the steering wheel, especially in a 911. They aren't necessarily BIG movements, amplitude-wise, but they sometimes have to be FAST.

I think my explanation was a little foriegn to her, coming from the waterpumping, front-engine world.

TT

I totally agree with you Tom. The more oversteer tendency you have with a 911, the more you are going to saw the wheel if you want to be fast. You can also saw the wheel to change the attitude of the car in an understeer corner to help rotate the car faster, works very well!

[ttweed]

You can also saw the wheel to change the attitude of the car in an understeer corner to help rotate the car faster, works very well!

Kary-
Spoken like a 993-kinda guy! Understeering corners are pretty much non-existent in my SWB 911 with equal-sized tires front and rear. It is the poster child for oversteer.

Your suspension is so much more sophisticated than mine that it isn't even funny.

TT

[ttweed]

The facts just are not always the best answer

I wouldn't want any facts to get in the way of the smack-slinging! You guys are really building up a head of steam here getting ready for Buttonwillow, it's very entertaining.

Proceed to diss at will...

TT

[gulf911]

Thank You Tom!! My 911 Buddy!

Jad, Toms description is exactly correct. You say sawing I use toms quick movement. The point is, the wheel is not static in the corner.

Wait a minute!! did Jad just complement me?? Capt.?? Are you ok??

[ttweed]

Wait a minute!! did Jad just complement me?? Capt.?? Are you ok??

It's just head games he's playing on you, Dan. Jad is a master of psychological warfare tactics, and he is merely trying to instill a false sense of over-confidence in you while setting you up for the kill.

TT

[kary]

You can also saw the wheel to change the attitude of the car in an understeer corner to help rotate the car faster, works very well!

Kary-
Spoken like a 993-kinda guy! Understeering corners are pretty much non-existent in my SWB 911 with equal-sized tires front and rear. It is the poster child for oversteer.

Your suspension is so much more sophisticated than mine that it isn't even funny.

TT

Nonetheless Tom, set it up with some oversteer and it does the same thing as your older 911, maybe just at higher speeds and more stable.

[MikeD]

It seems the 944 concensus of some is, if you aren't holding the wheel steady you aren't smooth...

I rode w/ Jackie (Ms. 944-Spec) Corwin at the last autox, and she rode in my 911, and after the first practice session, she asked me why I was moving the wheel so much and so fast.

I told her it's not the steering wheel inputs that have to be smooth, it's the car's movement that counts. As long as the vehicle is smoothly carving the desired arc at a good slip angle, and transitioning weight smoothly from side to side without upsetting the grip of the tires, it doesn't really matter what the driver is doing with the steering wheel to accomplish that. Sometimes it takes quick little corrections to be smooth, with both the throttle AND the steering wheel, especially in a 911. They aren't necessarily BIG movements, amplitude-wise, but they sometimes have to be FAST.

I think my explanation was a little foriegn to her, coming from the waterpumping, 50/50, front-engine, 944 world.

TT

This is they way I've heard it also. I could be wrong but I do not think this is exclusive to the 911. Even in my 47/53 "balanced" 986 I make slight 'adjustments' to the wheel in just about every corner to keep the car smooth. But I'm still a noob to this sport, so maybe I'm doing it wrong.