PCA SDR

Hi all. I have been investigating torsion bars and found some interesting thoughts on another forum. Folks there claim they are using 26 9/16 length VW torsion bars for the rear of their 924S/944's. If so that makes the ones at the provided link quite a bargain. Can anyone verify this as a viable fit?

http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=C12%2D6569%2D28

if the spline count and diameter at the splines... and the length are correct then it would work. The torsion bars are rather inexpensive to begin with. Contact Sway A Way. they have a good line of bars. also, used bars pop up occasionally for cheap.

If the VW bars measure up and are the size you want, I say go for it.

I really would rather get the Porsche specific ones, I missed a set a guy had, he offered them, I hesitated, and when I got back to him a day later they were gone 30mm Sway Aways. New they at right at $300

This is what a gent who bought the VW ones posted:

"The t-bars from CIP1 aren't an exact match. The difference is the length of the splines on the outside end of the bars. There are about 1/2 inch more splines on these bars.

Why is that a problem?
It's not, unless your doing the hole-saw-in-the-rocker-panels method and removing the end of the t-bar cover to just insert the new bars from the outside.
There's no way to seat the inside splines first because the outside start in the grooves first."

Then in another post:

"The Cip1 bars are in my 944, work fine. I did 28mm with 275lb front springs, pretty well balanced. The only difference I found was the length of the splines. Factory bars have less spline. After looking at the sway-away, I think they are the same way. Not an issue unless your trying to swap them without dropping the suspension."

The short coming is that they only go up to a 28mm, the internal debate is between a 28mm and 350lb OR 30mm and 400lb. Mark R runs the first one because he "likes the rear a little loose" his car is mostly likely a few hundred pounds lighter then mine and he is on stickier tires. John and several other folks run the second option and like it. Tim C mentioned that various mixes of those rateing are used and it basically boils down to driver preferance.

On the other hand I could try the VW's and be the test dummy for the club as it could save folks lots of money if it works. If anyone has some for sale, let me know.

Mmagus wrote: The short coming is that they only go up to a 28mm, the internal debate is between a 28mm and 350lb OR 30mm and 400lb. Mark R runs the first one because he "likes the rear a little loose"...

Not a 944 guy, here, so I have nothing to contribute to this discussion, but I do have a question about this quote. You say Mark R runs the the "first one" (the softer of the two setups above) because he "likes the rear a little loose." Is that as opposed to "a lot loose"? Given the same front spring rates, the second, stiffer setup in the rear ain't going to make the car "tighter."

In stock form your car is over 200 pounds lighter than a 944

ttweed wrote:

Mmagus wrote: The short coming is that they only go up to a 28mm, the internal debate is between a 28mm and 350lb OR 30mm and 400lb. Mark R runs the first one because he "likes the rear a little loose"...

Not a 944 guy, here, so I have nothing to contribute to this discussion, but I do have a question about this quote. You say Mark R runs the the "first one" (the softer of the two setups above) because he "likes the rear a little loose." Is that as opposed to "a lot loose"? Given the same front spring rates, the second, stiffer setup in the rear ain't going to make the car "tighter."

I am unsure as well, but am relatig what Mark R. said to me

JERRY B wrote:In stock form your car is over 200 pounds lighter than a 944

Completely true my friend. But last time I checked Marks car, and the Spec folks I have been chatting with they are in cars that are far from stock form

The VW and 924 torsion bar part numbers are the same on the Sway-A-Way website, so the part you listed might work. I use Sway-A-Way myself...

Ward Komers wrote:The VW and 924 torsion bar part numbers are the same on the Sway-A-Way website, so the part you listed might work. I use Sway-A-Way myself...

Nice catch there Ward. Sway a-way Part #1228 is both the VW 26 9/16 bar and the Porsche 924/944 bar in their parts list. The plot thickens!

For your reading pleasure!!!

http://www.924.org/techsection/10suspension.htm

When I saw the title of this post, I was thinking alternative as in alternative to using torsion bars at all. I know the VW guys buy stock 944 torsion bars and use them because they are cheap, with higher spring rates than VW and available, so the inverse is possible. VW doesn't go to as high a spring rate though and that is the down side. Even using a 30mm bar only gets you around 380 in spring rate. I truly used an alternative, Koni coil overs in the rear so the torsion bars are now optional and I can changeout/not use torsion bars depending on handling tuning. All I need to remove/adjust torsion bar is a jack. Car is at RSR if you want a closer look.

David Polk wrote:For your reading pleasure!!!

http://www.924.org/techsection/10suspension.htm

REALLY nice find! I have it bookmarked. Thanks!

harnishclan wrote:Even using a 30mm bar only gets you around 380 in spring rate.

Hmmm charts on Clarks and at the site Dave listed seem to say otherwise..(though I have NO idea personally...lol)

harnishclan wrote:I truly used an alternative, Koni coil overs in the rear so the torsion bars are now optional and I can changeout/not use torsion bars depending on handling tuning. All I need to remove/adjust torsion bar is a jack. Car is at RSR if you want a closer look.

Unfortunatly that also kicks me right out of GSS and then its buying sticky tires, stripping weight...removing powersteering....the slippery slope of upgrades! lol

Mmagus wrote:

ttweed wrote:

Mmagus wrote: The short coming is that they only go up to a 28mm, the internal debate is between a 28mm and 350lb OR 30mm and 400lb. Mark R runs the first one because he "likes the rear a little loose"...

Not a 944 guy, here, so I have nothing to contribute to this discussion, but I do have a question about this quote. You say Mark R runs the the "first one" (the softer of the two setups above) because he "likes the rear a little loose." Is that as opposed to "a lot loose"? Given the same front spring rates, the second, stiffer setup in the rear ain't going to make the car "tighter."

I am unsure as well, but am relatig what Mark R. said to me

JERRY B wrote:In stock form your car is over 200 pounds lighter than a 944

Completely true my friend. But last time I checked Marks car, and the Spec folks I have been chatting with they are in cars that are far from stock form

My car runs 350 Weltmeister spring, Racers Edge Camber Plates, 28mm rear torsion bars and Koni Sport shocks all around. The 350lb springs and 28mm torsion bars work really well together. You have to match the torsion bars and spring rates. I would recommend either my set up or a 400lb/30mm set up. Your mileage may vary.

We will see in a couple weeks, I just made the order.

Correct me if I am wrong but changing the spring rate will knock you out of GSS anyway.

In AS/S through JS/S, you get 6 points. (A flaw in our current rules) to use as you wish as long as you run 140 or higher tread wear tires. In a GSS car you could change springs and torsion bars (2pts), sway bars (2 points) and camber plates (2 pts) and run 140 tread wear tires. By going to RA1's, you would be in GS class and maxed out at 8 points. Never made much sense to me.