Classify your car for 2012

[pdy]

Interesting tool Tom, thanks for the time you are putting into this. I like the fact that we can see everybody's points.

Paul Young : Looks like we are in the same class CC11. What kind of tires are you running with those odd sizes? Are these ply slicks sizes?

Front Tread Width (mm): 231
Rear Tread Width (mm): 279

These are the A-Bomb slicks (9.1 inches front and 11.0 inches rear). I probably won't be running these much at PCA events next year.

[Mark Garriott]

Oh boy. In the same class as Mark R, PDY and Hassan

[tb911]

Open-ended steel lug nuts for cars with wheel spacers
Open-ended steel lug nuts are required for all cars

This is not a new rule -- though perhaps it isn't very well known. The new tool does bring things out that were buried in the rulebook

[tb911]

One nit to pick -- are Monoballs and non-stock camber adjustment either/or assessments? One, the other or both should tally to 20 points?

Monoball is free if it is part of a system to increase the camber adjustment.

If it was added to the car separately and independently of your mechanism to increase camber, then you need to take points for both

[tb911]

This is a great tool, but there are currently cars listed multiple times with different mod points. I guess it's not accurate information until everybody figured out in which class and mods they will be running in 2012 and list their car only once.

It does look like people are entering a lot of different variations -- I guess they are always tinkering with their cars.

[Greg Phillips]

This is a great tool, but there are currently cars listed multiple times with different mod points. I guess it's not accurate information until everybody figured out in which class and mods they will be running in 2012 and list their car only once.

It does look like people are entering a lot of different variations -- I guess they are always tinkering with their cars.

With the tire rules, changing from RA1 to 710, slicks or Hoosiers will change your points.
Also some people have both 16 (245f & 265r) and 17 (245 or 255f and 275r) inch wheels and the tire sizes change.
At some point people will probably settle on a class for the year and if they have smaller or less sticky tires, they will stay in the higher class rather than doing half a season in one class and half in another.

Greg

[pdy]

This is a great tool, but there are currently cars listed multiple times with different mod points. I guess it's not accurate information until everybody figured out in which class and mods they will be running in 2012 and list their car only once.

It does look like people are entering a lot of different variations -- I guess they are always tinkering with their cars.

Looking at various class options for Snickers, depending on tire compound, aero, camber truss, and tire size (CC04 to CC07).
And the points inflation is amazing! Earlier when I checked using the 2012 rules, Snickers maxed out at 450, now it's 535 - A TWO-class jump -Sheez!

Not sure what car and class I'll run for 2012 in Zone 8 at this time, but it'll probably be Snickers...

[martinreinhardt]

Open-ended steel lug nuts for cars with wheel spacers
Open-ended steel lug nuts are required for all cars

This is not a new rule -- though perhaps it isn't very well known. The new tool does bring things out that were buried in the rulebook

I remember this rule from PCA club racing, but didn't know it applied to AX and TT. And I am not sure I understand this requirement at 100%.
"Open-Ended Steel Lug Nuts" ??? Does this then mean about 80% cars do NOT comply to the rules since Porsche stopped installing studs after about 1999?

If this is the case I am predicting the attendance to start dropping dramatically, because most people will not install studs for parking lot racing. The parts are not expensive, but the labor is. Unless we are allowed to use the bolt in type studs, then it may be a couple hundreds in parts.

[Mmagus]

Looking at various class options for Snickers, depending on tire compound, aero, camber truss, and tire size (CC04 to CC07).
And the points inflation is amazing! Earlier when I checked using the 2012 rules, Snickers maxed out at 450, now it's 535 - A TWO-class jump -Sheez!

Not sure what car and class I'll run for 2012 in Zone 8 at this time, but it'll probably be Snickers...

Paul. Lose the bracing, go to 205's and 225's non-sticky tires and come on down to CC3 with Jerry B and I.

Oh, wait, I am going to a stock rear sway... Hello CC2!

[pdy]

Open-ended steel lug nuts for cars with wheel spacers
Open-ended steel lug nuts are required for all cars

This is not a new rule -- though perhaps it isn't very well known. The new tool does bring things out that were buried in the rulebook

I remember this rule from PCA club racing, but didn't know it applied to AX and TT. And I am not sure I understand this requirement at 100%.
"Open-Ended Steel Lug Nuts" ??? Does this then mean about 80% cars do NOT comply to the rules since Porsche stopped installing studs after about 1999?

If this is the case I am predicting the attendance to start dropping dramatically, because most people will not install studs for parking lot racing. The parts are not expensive, but the labor is. Unless we are allowed to use the bolt in type studs, then it may be a couple hundreds for parts.

Plus, Guess what? Cars that have been converted to studs are illegal in PCA National PCR rules for Showroom-Stock classes!

Obviously, this rule needs to be changed - maybe just mandate the steel for Time Trials (not AX or DE), and make it an "Administrative" change.

[martinreinhardt]

Plus, Guess what? Cars that have been converted to studs are illegal in PCA National PCR rules for Showroom-Stock classes!

Obviously, this rule needs to be changed - maybe just mandate the steel for Time Trials (not AX or DE), and make it an "Administrative" change.

That's interesting Paul. I would suggest to change this requirement to: steel lug nuts or steel lug bolts. So no magnesium lug nuts, which I am guessing is where this rule comes from.

[Mmagus]

I remember this rule from PCA club racing, but didn't know it applied to AX and TT. And I am not sure I understand this requirement at 100%.
"Open-Ended Steel Lug Nuts" ??? Does this then mean about 80% cars do NOT comply to the rules since Porsche stopped installing studs after about 1999?

If this is the case I am predicting the attendance to start dropping dramatically, because most people will not install studs for parking lot racing. The parts are not expensive, but the labor is. Unless we are allowed to use the bolt in type studs, then it may be a couple hundreds for parts.

Plus, Guess what? Cars that have been converted to studs are illegal in PCA National PCR rules for Showroom-Stock classes!

Obviously, this rule needs to be changed - maybe just mandate the steel for Time Trials (not AX or DE), and make it an "Administrative" change.[/quote]


Is this an AX Chair Admin thing...or a Safety Chair Admin thing?

[martinreinhardt]

Is this an AX Chair Admin thing...or a Safety Chair Admin thing?

It probably is a Rules and Tech chair issue.

Personally I won't be affected by this as I am already way down the slippery slope with my car, but I don't think everybody will install a wheel stud conversion kit just to AX.

[rshon]

I remember where the "open nut" rule comes from. The older cars with alloy wheels came stock with alloy, closed-top nuts. The old rules stipulated that if spacers were used, the car should be switched to open-top nuts, so Tech could insure that there was enough thread engagement between the nut and the stud, and the only safe, commonly available ones were made out of steel (used on cars with steel wheels). I believe there also used to be some language to the effect that "cars with wheel bolts should use (appropriately) longer bolts when spacers are installed", which only makes sense, but the most enforcement at AX Tech I ever experienced was just being asked to make sure you actually did that...

[mrondeau]

The "Open Nut" rules only apply to cars using spacers or cars with 400+ modification points. All other cars are fine with whatever factory lug nuts or bolts they currently have.
When you classify your car, only the items in red at the bottom apply to your car as appropriate. i.e. if you don't have wheel spacers, you don't need open ended steel lug nuts.

If you are using wheel spacers or have over 400 modification points, you wouldn't be in street stock anyway.