Classify your car for 2012

[ttweed]

Bill I., Steve G and Jad have all said the same thing to me over the past couple of years i.e. "There's always another 1/2 second out there." In other words, no matter how well you do, you can always do better.

So true, Mark! My way of looking at it is that my best lap of the day is the one I made the least number of mistakes on.

TT

[pecivil]

.

Just getting cars with similar performance in the same class is the goal for 2012

as I read these really thoughtful and insightful responses, the above statement hits it right on the nose. What is the purpose of classing? To group cars of similar performance to be driven by drivers of differing ability in competition against each other. What does "similar performance" really mean? Similar times or similar cars? Performance implies times, not cars equipment at our level.

So there is this inherent dichotomy going on between equal cars and unequal drivers. What has more weight at our level of driving? It is obviously the driver that is the controlling factor. To me that indicates all the playing around with numbers and hp/wt ratios may be somewhat of a sideshow. The same names pop up at the top of the leader board because they are better drivers in any car. Do adjustable sway bars give a newbie the same advantage as an long experienced driver? Absolutely not. How about wings, or adjustable dampers? I have had adj. dampers for a year now and I am just getting a feel for how changing the settings changes how the car handles.

In math terms, Its like if you have a function(performance), whose 1st term is x^3 (driver's ability) and 2nd term is x^1 (car's performance ability). The drivers influence on the final value has much more importance than the car's influence at our level with the possible exception of tires.

Trying to "equalize" cars becomes an exercise in futility to a large degree if the main variable is the driver. Maybe the only real way to do it would be to have several of the best drivers drive all the cars and they could be classed equally on lap times driven under the same conditions by the same guys.

[JERRY B]

Ok Monte, You can rate my car
Now where did I put those 10 year old all season tires ?

[mcipseric]

Hi Guys,

If you go the HP/Weight route in the 2012 classification, do you still have to take points for exhaust and/or cat removal?

Thanks,

Eric

[ttweed]

If you go the HP/Weight route in the 2012 classification, do you still have to take points for exhaust and/or cat removal?

Eric-

If you measure HP (dyno the car), you do not have to take points for any of the listed individual engine modifications, including exhaust or cat removal, as long as the car is dyno'd in that configuration (which it should be--measured "as raced"). If your engine is stock, and you are using the published factory spec as your HP figure (not measuring), then you take the points for any exhaust mods. If the engine has a reprogrammed ECU (or aftermarket "chip"), then you must measure HP on the dyno.

HTH,
TT

[mcipseric]

My 99 996 came with the aero kit and is on the option code sticker. Do I have to take the 10 points for this?
What is messing me up is the “Non-stock Wing,” mine is stock.
I am guessing that I do not have to take any points like the GT3s are not taking points for their aero or adjustable sway bars.

Thanks for your time.

Eric

[pdy]

My 99 996 came with the aero kit and is on the option code sticker. Do I have to take the 10 points for this?
What is messing me up is the “Non-stock Wing,” mine is stock.
I am guessing that I do not have to take any points like the GT3s are not taking points for their aero or adjustable sway bars.

Thanks for your time.

Eric

Eric:

I believe you need to take points for the aero kit. While it is "Factory", it is an option (i.e., not delivered on ALL cars of that model and year).
Yes, indeed, the rules descriptions could be clearer here, but the little blue "more" link on the classification pages do offer more information.

[Don Middleton]

... I am guessing that I do not have to take any points like the GT3s are not taking points for their aero or adjustable sway bars...

Eric, you've come across one of the "holes" in the new system, in my opinion. You can't use "GT" variants of models for comparison because they are treated like they are standard models in themselves, i.e. their many upgrades are treated as if they are part of the base model.

The base points calculation only considers weight, HP, age and wheel size. The GT variants gets dinged for those "enhancements" over their related base model (996, 997). But, other upgrades like aero and adjustable bars are not penalized. Basically, as has been pointed out by others, if you upgraded your 996 to have the equivalent features of the 996 GT3, you have far more points.

So, you need to take the points. Next year, the GT variants should be taking them, too. But, that's just my opinion. We'll see...

[mcipseric]

I have submitted the above question to Tom Brown the Zone 8 Rules Coordinator. I will post what his reply is.

Eric

[mcipseric]

Reply from Tom Brown the Zone 8 Rules Coordinator:

Eric, I can see the confusion; hopefully I can clarify. Basically, as defined in the Zone 8 rules (which may be different than other definitions) if the factory considered it an option, it is labeled "non-stock".

From Part III, Assessment of Points

“Non-stock” equipment includes both factory optional equipment and aftermarket products.


So, it does appear to be 10 points.

hope this helps

tb

[jenniferreinhardt]

As part of the AX pre-reg team, I have several registrations where people have just entered "unknown" for their car class. I have sent emails with links to where to classify your car, and we have several forum threads for reference. The thought has crossed my mind to make everyone who registers without their car class an X Car. Or perhaps there would be a volunteer to walk these people through the process. PM me if you can help. If you are one of the people who entered unknown as their class and now know your class, you can also PM with the info.
Thanks!

[Tim Comeau]

Without reading thru 7 pages of posts, did anyone else classify a fully prepared 944 SPEC car and come out in CC05? I'm especially interested to ensure that the higher compression 88 944's and 924S's end up in the same class as the earlier, lower compression 944 Spec cars because they can shave their head to match the later cars power. I've marked my listing as a Spec car by typing in 944 SPEC instead of the color of my car. Others?

[Don Middleton]

...did anyone else classify a fully prepared 944 SPEC car and come out in CC05?...

Tim, I see that Leigh Rayner and Chuck/Debbie Sharp both classed their 944 SPEC cars in CC05 with the same points...

[ChuckS]

Tim,
Yes a full 944 Spec does seem to class out as CC05 - if you can figure out the conflicting rules. It is easier just to class as 944 Spec. There is a place to do that, I just don't remember exactly where.
As long as the motor is stock, I did not see any differences in an 88 vs early cars. Not sure about 924S's. They might have different base points.

[Tim Comeau]

OK, great. It looked like the 88's had higher base points- reference Chris Barrington's entry. My 88 chassis has an 87 engine, so I classified it as an 87.
This is all so complex for me........you see, when I started ax'ing, there were only about 6 classes. Total.
Oh, and our timing system was a sundial...
.the track was uphill both ways in the snow...