KP 1-2-3 & 6

[Jad]

KP getting 1st, 2nd, 3rd & 6th in the BRI at Fontana says either our class is insane or the BRI is off. Since we got 10th, 11th & 13th overall in streetable cars, I don't think it is the BRI's problem

Hopefully I can get my car repaired in time for Streets, it should be another fun battle

[kary]

Jad, that is interesting. My car is streetable also though I placed 4th overall and 7th in the BRI. Of course that was using slicks but at WSIR in January when I used some Dunlop's street tires I turned 1:32.3's 4's and 8's which would have put me around 8th overall and 10th in the BRI had I of used them in the time trail session. In stead I used the slicks and foudn it difficult to heat them up int he cool temperatures in only two laps.

So is the BRI off or is it the drivers? I think you guys in KP are turning some very good times with your cars so I tend to feel your driving as a group is very good. It will be fun to see how you guys do on some of the more technical tracks and who will be victorious this year, water pumpers or air heads!

[Mats]

Jad,
first I feel your frustration, 70mS on a 2 mile track...well I've been lucky lately. I hope to increase the gap with more driving skills, but unfortunately my funds are out and I will have to wait until Spring Mountain for that. So KP boys, til then stay up there on the BRI !!

[Jad]

Mats, sorry to hear that. I was looking forward to battling it out all year.

Kary, I think your time is very good for your car, but I think your car could be faster for its class. Did that make sense? I think your time is very good, but could be better in a better prepared car for the class. Doing as well as you do in the BRI is pretty impressive.

Through some RA1's on and play with KP....

[kary]

Mats, sorry to hear that. I was looking forward to battling it out all year.

Kary, I think your time is very good for your car, but I think your car could be faster for its class. Did that make sense? I think your time is very good, but could be better in a better prepared car for the class. Doing as well as you do in the BRI is pretty impressive.

Through some RA1's on and play with KP....

Jad, if I understand you correctly you are saying I can can modify my car more in the "I" class, correct? If that is correct you are spot on in that I only have 21 points putting me at the lowest possible level of "I".

I have taken the approach over the years of replacing parts when they wear out or are unsafe for the car use, but unfortunately (or fortunately), depending upon the perspective, the car has not had any failures and the modifications have been slow to come. Having some new gears that are closer in ratio and use all 6 gears along with a R&P change would give the car another 30 HP effectively. Along with some weight reduction and changes in the motor and exhaust would provide a very competitive car for some of our AR1 boys. I have not done them yet because the car has not failed and these are costly modifications (Knock on wood). If I were to make these changes it would be worth another few seconds in combination in a lap, maybe more.

That said, I am not sure how I could join you guys in KP since my car is not a "K" class car. Additionally, I ran the Dunlop Super Sport race tires which are the same level tire as the Toyo at WSIR in January during practice and consistently turned 1:32's with that tire when I used them. Not sure that would be fair in KP since the closed time in KP was 1:34.

[jrgordonsenior]

Kary a G50/21 with a Guards LSD and I'd wager you'd drop 2 seconds easily at WSIR. Throw in an exhaust system including 100 cell cats (or lose them altogether) and you'd be really cooking....

[Dan Chambers]

So is the BRI off or is it the drivers?

Kary, Jad, others:

The way I understand it, the BRI was designed/developed for A-X's and was intended to give the SS and S classes a "fair adjustment" to those drivers with more advanced modifications: Level "P" and above.

Carl Scragg and I have had numorous discussions about the BRI as it relates to A-X vs. TT, and I've heard whispers on other threads about the need for someone to develope a TT BRI.

So, my understanding is, the current BRI is an AX tool for SS and S rated drivers to say "all thing being equal, I'm a driver that can hold my own..."

That a "Prepared" class of cars got 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 6th is very interesting indeed. Oh yeah....... how many of those KP BRI spots were turbo's? Can you say .... "all spooled up with somewhere to go?"

Regardless of the BRI, Mats and Jad drove some great times, with Bob B. and Martin R. doing a fine job of representing the Hot-Air types. Nice driving by all those KP guys.

Wish I were there to see it.......

[kary]

Dan, the BRI used for time trial is for time trail and has different indices from auto-x.

[Otto]

Dan:

The BRI factors we are using now for TTs were newly developed by popular demand earlier this year to take into account the differences between the AX setting and TT setting. As such we now have two different BRIs, one for AXs and one for TTs. Hopefully the new TT-specific factors will provide a better measurement of the relative performance of the drivers in those events, as they should be handicapping the cars more accurately than before. As usual, these factors are meant to apply to fully developed cars for each class and preparation level

[David Ray]

Although I don't quite understand the BRI rating system it's impressive that there are four (4) 944 class cars in the top 25. Three turbo’s and one normally aspirated car. Porsche should rethink the re-make of the 928 and look at a “new 944” . The 944 (and its four cylinder engine) has always been the car of choice for performance and handling!!

[Dan Chambers]

Aha! I did not know that. Thanks, Kary and Otto. I am now updated.

Dan

[bibbetson]

Nice run everyone! Sorry I wasn't part of it (or maybe I'm not ). One note worth mentioning as far as the BRI and KP goes - KP has many 100% cars, meaning that the cars are maxed out for the class. That certainly helps with getting them to the top of the BRI - not to knock the drives . Many (maybe most) cars are not fully prepared for a given class and that can dramatically effect their BRI results even though the car/drive may be winning their class. Kary's case in point is a perfect example.

I can't wait for Street. Finally a track where my non-turbo, wheezing, weight bucket won't be paddling to catch-up down the straights.

[kary]

.......... Many (maybe most) cars are not fully prepared for a given class and that can dramatically effect their BRI results even though the car/drive may be winning their class. Kary's case in point is a perfect example.
...........
.

B,
I am not sure I conveyed correctly what I was saying above. I do not feel handicapped by a less prepared car for my class. I was pointing out that even with a less prepared car my car has posted good BRI results let alone overall results. Will I ever get to BRI #1 with the current car configuration, no way, but I steadily improve as I analyze my driving through data acquisition this year. If I can come close within 2 or 3 BRI positions of my overall position staying in the 3rd to 8th position I am pleased given the car configuration. If I did add another 19 points to my car that would be something....just not this year

[JHPGT3]

.......... Many (maybe most) cars are not fully prepared for a given class and that can dramatically effect their BRI results even though the car/drive may be winning their class. Kary's case in point is a perfect example.
...........
.

B,
I am not sure I conveyed correctly what I was saying above. I do not feel handicapped by a less prepared car for my class. I was pointing out that even with a less prepared car my car has posted good BRI results let alone overall results. Will I ever get to BRI #1 with the current car configuration, no way, but I steadily improve as I analyze my driving through data acquisition this year. If I can come close within 2 or 3 BRI positions of my overall position staying in the 3rd to 8th position I am pleased given the car configuration. If I did add another 19 points to my car that would be something....just not this year

Kary,
With all due respect , why are you preoccupied with a scheme (BRI) that everyone knows and agrees (even the creator) is inaccurate and inappropriate to use for TTs? BRI has been overanalyzed and discredited (for use in TTs) --let's not do that again. Why would it be your "goal" to achieve something that's meaningless?

[Otto]

John:

Please refer to postings earlier in this thread noting that there is a new BRI specifically created early this year and currently being used to handicap cars in the TT setting as the AX BRI was, as you say, not appropriate for Time Trials. Hopefully BRI results for TT drivers will be more significant now, and Kary's is.