86 911 a/c thoughts/comparisons vs. Boxster?

[sean996]

HI all,

My wife's daily driver is a 2005 Boxster. I've got her talked into an older 911 ... one in the autotrader ... '86 2nd owner with 46k miles for $23k. Then she asked me about the a/c vs. her Boxster. I gulped ... is this gonna be a deal killer? Do any of the a/c upgrades make the car cold in stop/go traffic in the climate conditions we are experiencing right now?

Thanks all,

Sean

[pdy]

I had an '86 Turbo, with the stock (Old Freon) AC. It worked fine in 100°F weather, but I suspect a lot hotter might have made it marginal.
One would think with upgraded components it would perform at least as well (even with R-134a).

Porsche made big vent and AC improvements for the 1986 model year, so it's much better than '85 or earlier (but not as robust as late-model Porsches.

[Pete Millikin]

My 86 had air which was not maintained and did cool very well. The only relevant data point is that the blowerrs / motors were relatively loud. Someone out there probably has experience a well maintained unit's effectiveness.

Yikes - Edit to first line to ...did NOT cool very well.

[Steve Grosekemper]

As Porsche technician and owner of a 1983 911 that has most of the possible A/C upgrades I can tell you that there is no way you are going to get an 86 911 to cool anything like a Boxster/996. A Boxster will cool even better than a 996 just because the cabin is so much smaller.

The first problem is the condenser. The one on the 911 is a good size but needs the engine for cooling and doesn't get enough air until about 3000 RPM.
At slow speed there just isn't enough air flow. If caught in traffic I will keep the revs up to about 2000 to increase the cooling... I really hate being hot.

The second problem is ventilation. I have upgraded vents in my car (about 80% increase over stock) and it blows like a hurricane... but as Pete said it is loud!
The upgraded vent is not louder, the car is louder.

I was driving 30-minute freeway trips yesterday in 100+ degree heat and I had to turn my fan and temp down because I was getting too cold. About 40 degrees out the center vent which is 10-15 lower than the factory spec for a 964. But when I got to the stop light to stop light stuff I lost about 50% of the cooling and had to go back to full cold settings.

The 964 and later cars all have a single huge condenser in the front of the car with a huge electric fan on it. So the cooling is constant regardless of road speed.

I can't imagine anyone going from one of these late cars to a pre 89 car and not complaining about the climate control... Which it doesn't have. The controls are..."Unique" for someone not accustomed to the car.

This doesn't even start to scratch the issue of the several thousands of dollars in A/C upgrades you will need or the fact that it steers like a truck in a parking garage or the fact that the clutch is stiff and the shifter is worse...

Ahhh... but there is nothing like the feeling of driving an air cooled torsion bar 911 and listening to your 15-year old daughter giggle with delight as the tach searches for red on the way up a freeway on ramp (and lifting before reaching the posted legal speed limit)

[rshon]

If she's never driven one of the early cars (and she likes the late model car) she should try one before you sell the Boxster, because it's ALOT DIFFERENT, especially as a daily driver, double especially if you're not that tall. I love the older cars, but for every day use (or especially a road trip), I love the newer cars even more.
-R

[sean996]

Thanks everyone for the replies and very detailed responses. The last thing I want to do is make her even more miserable in stop/go traffic.

So the post '89 cars have better climate control, but still probably not like the newer cars?

Thanks again all,

Sean

[Steve Grosekemper]

No... post 89 cars have climate controls...
Earlier cars have no less than 3 levers on the dash for fresh and hot air direction for heat and defrost, 2 knobs in the center console for A/C and either 1or 2 levers or a knob for heat between the seats. Some pre-flight instruction may be needed....
I have been told if you can work the heat/ac on a 911 while driving and drinking a cup of coffe you are automatically certified to fly a cessna 182.

964 and later cars have real climate control. 996/Boxster cars have real good climate control. (and very trouble free)
But the best working and least troublesome climate control (of the other cars) is late 944/968.
928's work well, but I wouldn't call them trouble free...

[cam]

I always thought you had to have schooling in egyptian heiroglyphics to run the controls. Maybe a tech session is in order to explain how they work. How many people will admit they don't know???

[Jad]

It is easy to set the climate control, just turn the dial to the desired temp... oops, that is the 86 944, for an 86 911, this is not a DIY job. The owners manual states, "If temperature change is required, take the vehicle to your dealer*"

*Towing is not necessary.

I recommend Dieters or Blackforest for this job

[Dan Chambers]

Anyone who owned an earlier (Porsche) Beetle (spelled V-o-l-k-s-w-a-g-o-n Type I) knows how to operate the climate control:

Too hot? Roll down the window (use left hand if driving: right hand if passenger). Too cold? Roll up window and pull red levers next to hand-brake.
Defrost/defog window: use towel stuffed behind the seat. Rub quickly and with commitment. Yes, it is Rocket Surgery!

How difficult is that?!?

As for the "intricate if esoteric" controls on the dash of a pre '89 911 (spelled L-A-T-E-R V-O-L-K-S-W-A-G-O-N): put all the levers on the dash to the far left and follow the instructions for "earlier Porsche" listed above. Not good enough? Get a Ford.