X CARS

[John Straub]

I think we should just rename the region "Porsche and Other Car Driving Club". Those that don't like it can start another region in San Diego exclusive to Porsches. That way everyone is happy.

John

[Jad]

I think we should just rename the region "Porsche and Other Car Driving Club". Those that don't like it can start another region in San Diego exclusive to Porsches. That way everyone is happy.

John

Nice try John, but you know the 911 guys don't want the 944's in 'their' club, the aircooled guys don't want any of these cheap 'modern' water cooled cars, and if Ted M had his way, I think only 356's would be allowed in the Porsche club

You will NEVER make everyone happy! Except maybe with beer

[Aavitt]

I am fine with X-cars participating in our AX events. It has added a much needed boost to our budget and made board meetings much less stressful. I am in favor of charging "non-members" in X-cars and P-cars $10 extra and also limiting the # of X-cars per event. Members in X-cars are not an issue. They pay their dues, and 99% of them also work a chair position or volunteer. No increase in AX fees for "members" in X-cars! Seems like once a member always a member whether you have a P- car or not. Monte, I will not out you to National since I like you, but I think you should consider taking a chair position next year. Coming in second TTOD automatically qualifies you to be AX Chair. We can talk to Jerry next AX. And also letting me beat you occassionally will keep you my good graces.

The optimum number of drivers at an AX is 100. Does anyone really want to see 120 to140 drivers at an event. Be honest. 100 drivers makes money and meets the corner working needs and puts less strain on the instructor core. Even though I personally hold 4 chair positions, I am still willing to work a corner if I have to. All of us want the most bang for our buck and I would not be content to see the AX reduced to a 3-3-3 event. A parade lap and 4-4-4 is acceptable and a parade lap and 5-5-4 is even better.

When member P-car pre-registrations reaches 90, we should limit the X-cars to 10. When member P-car pre-registrations reaches 100, we can still allow 10 X-cars, at the discretion of the AX chair, if they feel that the Instructor core can handle it. It seems inevitable that X-car drivers have to become Instructors. That is for the CDI's to decide.

I know that this is not the popular opinion, but if we can make money and meet the corner working needs at 100-110, why should members lose laps just to accommodate more X-car drivers?

The DE/TT program is definitely picking up steam and making money this year. Yeah! Robert has allowed X-cars for sometime now and do not believe they have to pay any extra to participate. (Robert you can confirm or correct that)

Due to the budget constraints on last year's board and chairs, we have all learned how to plan an event that breaks even or makes money. We are all actively looking for sponsors and plan to continue operating on a tight budget. In that vein, I do NOT agree with providing alcohol to tired, hungry drivers at the end of the AX event. I know this is also not the popular opinion, but if it has to be, get a sponsor to provide the booze. Water, ice and gatorade should still be provided.

I do have an issue with adding X-cars drivers as an "Affiliate" member. The intent of the affiliate is for a husband or wife, a son or daughter, a brother or sister, a cousin or a good friend with a P-car. Although National puts no constraints on this process and the $46 annual fee does cover two people, and we do have the freedom to choose that person, it doesnt make it right in my book. The X-car driver added as an affiliate brings in no additional income to the AX event. This is still the Porsche Club and members should own a Porsche. As a 17 year member I would love to take the purist attitude and say P-cars only, but it is just unrealistic in this economy.

As far as non-members on the forum, I think they should be able to post, but again that is a member benefit and we are paying our dues as members, so why not charge them a "one-time" annual fee of $10.00. I do sympathize with X-car drivers because they do not have the ability to become a member of our club without the ownership of a P-car, unless a member adds them as an affiliate, but we are still the PORSCHE Club, not the SCCA and those are the current rules.

Angela Avitt, Membership Chair
E-master, Social Chair, TT Co-safety Chair
Car #425
2004 996 GT3
1999 996
2011 Z06
2008 BMW

[pecivil]

Monte, I will not out you to National since I like you,

WHEW! thanks Angela. I was worried there for a minute. Getting kicked out of PCA would totally suck. I would have to buy a Porsche to prevent that from happening.

BTW, I am still willing to trade your GT3 for my lotus!! See if Mike will go for it. maybe after a few

[JERRY B]

How about a 944 there are almost as fast If You Drive Flat-Out
I agree with Angela about Not having the adopt a X car thing that is going on,
Because If We Go Back to the old way, There Won't Be Any X Cars at All

[John Straub]

Yep...your right Jad...well worth a try. Thought I would just be PC.

John

[Ted Myrus]

The biggest advantage to parade laps is that they clean the course.

Tom, us old guys can't remember how much it cost. Its been a while, as I do multiple year renewals.

Jad, remember a real Carrera has 4 cams! Keep the 356 faith

[jenniferreinhardt]

The exclusivity of Porsche ownership, and exclusivity of being in a Porsche only car club that only has Porsche cars at its events. Key word here is "Exclusive". It makes me ponder on the Motto "its the people, not the cars" PCA likes to use.

Hi Monte and Fred! - You had Porsches, so I think it is fine to remain a member. I don't really care if non-Porsche owners become affiliates because they are connected to someone with a Porsche and it may rub off By the way, the slogan is "It's not just the cars, it's the people" implying that one commonality is Porsches.

We are having this discussion because we are charting unfamiliar waters and things need to be cleared up. Sounds like the BMW club has been allowing Non-Member X Cars for a long time - so they have a system. We'll figure it out and whoever was unfriendly years ago, I hope has received the same karma back. I think our club is very friendly nowadays. Our regulars and X-Cars are just getting to know e/o and like I said, it's warmer every time. We all just need to hang out together and have fun - shoot the sh!t. I did see the S200 guys off by themselves, so it would be great if there were a Liaison to encourage connections to the rest of the group.

Part of making connections and bonds is the awards gathering afterwards. Maybe people linger for their award and a cold beer, but we could change it to chips and dip - I don't care. I do care about those who drive at our AXs having a good vibe with e/o and then they will come back, and like some have said, those who don't have a Porsche may buy one one day.

So, cut out the booze insert chips.

[Jackie C]

Overall, it appears the consensus will be to keep the x cars on some level. I parked in "Hondaville" and they couldn't have been nicer or more willing to help. Granted, there will always be a spoiler in the crowd, but we have that in PCA as well. I think the naysayers should consider shouldering the work of the x car people before they condemn them. We need to charge them significantly more or they will continue to bring their x car buddies. Most I spoke with will still attend with an additional $20 charge. Hey, maybe they will be willing to be chairs.....!
How about just getting a beer sponsor? We are in the land of microbrews. It's a good compromise and the club won't be paying for it. We have nothing to lose by asking.

[martinreinhardt]

Most I spoke with will still attend with an additional $20 charge. Hey, maybe they will be willing to be chairs.....!

I have no problem having a certain limited amount of non-member X-cars who pay a higher entry free at our driving events, but non-PCA members should not be allowed to become chairs. The prerequisite to become a chair, should be a minimum of 1 year membership and frequent participation in our events.

[Kim Crosser]

Martin - So if one of them wanted to be the Equipment Chair, you would say "no"?

[Carl Scragg]

jennifer reinhardt wrote:

I did see the S200 guys off by themselves, so it would be great if there were a Liaison to encourage connections to the rest of the group.

I recognized at least one of the S2000 drivers helping out at the end of the day - and he had a couple of friends with him that I haven't met yet. . . . Carl

[martinreinhardt]

Martin - So if one of them wanted to be the Equipment Chair, you would say "no"?

Well, I think we should say no for insurance reasons. But, that it is a difficult position to fill.

[mikee]

I am a member with two sons that drive X cars and both would gladly pay an additional $10 more to participate. I haven't made either one an associate because I don't want to play favorites. Hopefully one of them will convince someone to adopt them as an associate and then I will taake the leftovers. Personally I don't see a problem with X cars as long as they help us offset the costs. If the total number exceeds our capacity to run within a normal day, then there should be a limit. However, I have noticed that we are starting later because people are getting to pretech later. Enforce the 7:30 close of pretech and we will probably shorten our day by an hour.

Mike Elovitz

[Don Middleton]

Martin - So if one of them wanted to be the Equipment Chair, you would say "no"?

Well, I think we should say no for insurance reasons. But, that it is a difficult position to fill.

Let me know if you find one that is willing.

I'm into my second year as DE/TT equipment chair and I'm ready to pass it along. I can make them my affiliate member.